The fail of chaos?

Ok, so I haven't been playing 40k that long but I don't understand what the problem is with the chaos codex...
Its not a bad codex, is it?

judchic wrote:Ok, so I haven't been playing 40k that long but I don't understand what the problem is with the chaos codex...
Its not a bad codex, is it?

its not bad but its really hard to play fluff wise, and there are some retarded inconsistency that we have with our loyalist kin.(land raiders)

bensutherland333 wrote:

judchic wrote:Ok, so I haven't been playing 40k that long but I don't understand what the problem is with the chaos codex...
Its not a bad codex, is it?

its not bad but its really hard to play fluff wise, and there are some retarded inconsistency that we have with our loyalist kin.(land raiders)

theres TONS of fluff Ben-is (i told you i'd bring up how you wrote you name)

But don't chaos get landraiders cheaper and possessed?

There area couple issues with the codex, but I can tell where all the hate comes from.

The main complaint that chaos players have with the book is that it was probably right at the height of the "simple is better" philosophy at GW.. soon after the chaos book, they reversed that and now things are getting much more vibrant again. The last chaos book had rules for.. oh, let me think.. about 9 different and very distinct armies..

Standard (Black Legion), Alpha legion, Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, Night Lords, Worldearters, Death Guard, Thousands Sons and Emperor's Children. Am I missing one? Anyway, each army was very unique and it spawned all sorts of wonderful army conversions and modelling ideas.

The new book came out, and well.. yeah, everything was mushed into one army. It took alot of the flavour out I would argue, which is really to bad.

The other big complaint is that is has several units that are pretty bad when compared to the other options available. The troops choices are all very strong.. the daemon prince is great, defiler, oblits, terminators.. all pretty decent.

So, to make a fairly competitive list you really have to trim the fat and stick with the stronger units.. which in the end gives you a mash up of the different legions in essence.

I was really dissapointed with the possessed in the new book, and more than anything else, the chaos lord. The possessed were really strong in the last book, so I could see a cost adjustment coming.. but the random power thing is tough to swallow. And the lord.. once you buy him a few things, hes as much a daemon prince and much worse. The daemon wepoan can be strong.. but roll a 1 and hes pretty much screwed.. plus, he can be insta-killed so you relaly have to be careful with him. The prince is so much better at everything.. I have taken a lord now and then to mix things up, but its always a dissapointment.

Land raiders are a bit cheaper, but are priced like that becasue they get no machine spirit.

I think though, that most chaos players were more dissapointed in the army changes than the unit problems I pointed out. All the uniqueness of running an Alpha legion army for example where the marines all infiltrated and you could stalk up on expendable human cultists dissapeared.. Even for me playing Worldeaters.. the army changed. I try to still play a straight Worldeaters when I can, but with the restrictions lifted from heavy and weapon choices.. and the mean daemon prince/bloodletter choices gone, Ive now got Obliterators and heavy tanks..

So, good things and bad things. Right before the new book had come out I had ordered about 40 assorted necromunda minis because I really wanted to make an Alpha legion force.. ..

GW.. and more specifically, Gav Thorpe.. has taken alot of heat with how the chaos book turned out. I dont really know if they'll have legion specific codexes.. or if they really need them.. but a return to special rules for the separate armies is sorely needed. I do think the chaos codex is definitely still playable in its standard format, and can be competitive, but its just not as colorful as it used to be.

i have always been a big fan of the word bearers,

i wish you could have bunch of cultists for a squad and a marine hero or something in there thats a bit more buffed then a normal marine. but of course there would be only one.

As has been stated, there is a HUGE complaint versus the fluffy'ness of the current codex. However, Chaos Space Marines are most definetly a top tier army. Daemon Princes are cheaper and better than HQ's in practically every other codex in the game. Our basic dudes come triple equiped with bolters, pistols, and swords. The whole army has high Leadership values. And Generic Summonable Daemons cost barely anything. Plague Marines are one of the toughest per-point troop models in all 40k.

So, if you are very attached to the 40k fluff and really want to feild a particular named legion, then this codex may not be for you. But if you are fine playing 'bad guys with awesome powers' then Go Chaos!

--Kill! Maim! Burn!

canadin wrote: However, Chaos Space Marines are most definetly a top tier army.

lol!!! if you want to reference a 'tier leveling' for codex's there is no way chaos would be in the 'top'

Let me explain. I personally do not believe in a tier ranking for 40k. I think there are A) books that are done right, B) books that are done wrong, and C) books that need an update. Chaos fits into a little from column B and a little from column C.

Take a look at all recent codexes since 5th edition, they are, for the most part, done right (except the FAQ for nids didn't help). All the older 3rd and 4th books, whether done right or wrong, desperately need an update.

Has anyone heard about what codex'es might be looked at next? All Ive heard coming up is DaemonHunters

It would be nice if GW gave those older books a 'refresher' like Dark Angels and Black Templars while we waited for them.

lolz top tier army lolz... if you played all Tzeentch and had this guy roll dice for you (EDITORS NOTE: Insert picture of myself later for laughs)

Although I recently had a read through the guardsman codex... ARE YOU KIDDING ME? I can never own a guard army now... I'm way too beardy for that dex, it'd be like super man fighting a dead cripple for his wallet. Or wait... I'll just play mike with my chaos counts as guardsman list.... Just imagine the look on his face when rhino bolters counts as multi lasers leaf blower him off the table!

@Ryan - Thanks for all the reasonable games, I now know how lights out they could have been.

Honestly how they hell does that dex squeak past without play testing?

Hey, no problem Tom. You are right. The guard book is very abusable. Triple vendetta's, 9 hydra's, etc.. I try to play my games around here with a competitive list. Not something my opponent is going to want to slit my throat over after turn 3. lol

If I were to go to a out of town tourny however...

Ryan's to much of a softy to turn that book loose...

@Tom - we should totally play a counts as game of Guard vs. Word Bearer Wolf Angels! If we get confused as to what counts as what we'll just call Matt he's an expert

miv305 wrote:
@Tom - we should totally play a counts as game of Guard vs. Word Bearer Wolf Angels! If we get confused as to what counts as what we'll just call Matt he's an expert

Ohhhh! Below the belt.

I feel a stabby knife like sensation in my back but I just cant seem to reach it