Chaos bugs Attack!

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Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Guest on Sun Sep 27, 2009 4:27 pm

*Below is the chronicle of an 8000 point tyranid/Chaos army Played by Randy(HiveMindRuik) vs an 8000 Pt Imperial Guad/Space marine/Grey Knight allied force played by Jim(Jemal) and Adam(Caros). We went with 2 strategic assets per side(not per player), and a pre-determined setup (One board being a ruined city defended by imperial forces, the other forested terrain from which the chaos bugs launched their attack. No mans land was a foot-long section on either side of the place the table joined.
(Also, I believe Adam has some photos which will be uploaded when we get a chance.)


On Wednesday September 23rd, a horde of chaos-controlled Tyranids assaulted an imperial city. They had amongst them inumerable swarms of gaunts(A 120 gaunt formation granting Without Number), massed hordes of Carnifexes and Hive Tyrants, and a lethal Hydrodule, backed up by Chaos tanks and troops and even a freshly desecrated Baneblade. (8000 points of Tyranids and Chaos)

The imperial guard manning the defense were sorely outnumbered, with commander Creed himself and an Inquisitor Lord locked in secret planning sessions even as the enemy forces approached. Imperial tanks raised their turrets, but little sign of the enemy could be seen through the debris (Spore Chimneys provided night fighting benefits for the 'bad guys', preventing most of the imperial guard from firing). It looked like a dark day as they slowly closed in.
(4000 pts of Guard on table)

A squad of teleporting chaos terminators arrived near to the command bunker, forcing the guards to gasp in fear as they were being assaulted from all sides, these could only be the first wave of a vicious assault. Sure enough, and unknown to the lowly guardsmen, three seperate hordes of tyranids had tunneled behind the ranks and were set to burst forth amongst the middle of the helpless defenders, but when their drooling fangs broke through the surface, they found themselves far from the fight - thanks to a powerful psychic disruptor provided by the Inquisition for just such an occassion.
(Disruptor Beacon Asset > Flank March Asset. ALL of the tyranids flank-marching ended up failing the roll and being marched on at the furthest end of the board where they could do nothing)

Before the remainder of the enemy could come too close, a massive thundering was heard as Lord Creed looked to the sky with grim satisfaction. "About time" He muttered as Space Marine and Grey Knight Drop pods thundered directly into the middle of the tyranid swarms, their landing blasting apart several of the bugs, and the Terminators and Dreadnoughts of the Inquisitorial fleet unleashing their weapons on everything nearby. (4000 points of Drop-pod marines/Grey Knights in a Death-Knell Orbital Strike Formation).
Bolstered by this influx of reinforcements, the guard continued pouring firepower into their opponents. A lone Guardsman had been waiting, virtually invisible, for the right time to reveal his presence, perched mere meters from the formidable Chaos Baneblade, and chose that opportunity to strike. With a shout for The Emperor, a powerful ancient relic was flung through the air to land with perfect aim upon the center of the gigantic tank. The explosion tore plating and treads off the great machine, severely damaging it before the swirling maelstrom dissapeared, leaving the tank barely funcional, but still capable of wreaking havoc.
(Vortex Grenade Asset took out 2 structure points on the Baneblade then scattered off board)
Seeing an oppening, Creed ordred the left flank of the imperial army to open fire, but none of them could see well enough to finish off the death machine... None but the Vindicare Assassin. Loading a special armour-piercing, High-explosive round saved for just such an occassion, the Assassin took his shot and moments later the massive war machine lumbered to a halt, no longer functional.

On the right side of the army, a pair of Lichtors had manged to worm their way unseen into the city, assaulting the guards on that side with deadly efficiency while more gaunts rejoined the tyranid horde, which turned its attention to the marines and Grey Knights in their midst. Brutal battle ensued, with the worried guard facing down the still-advancing chaos. Repeated Lascannon salvoes diminished but did not destroy the Chaos Terminators behind their lines, and overwhelming numbers of veterans managed to bring down the Lichtors while the imperial's own Baneblade rumbled forwards, its searchlights scanning through the spore looking for something to blow up.

**At this point, we called the game for several reasons (Not the least of which was time).
I think next time I'm in such a massive apocalypse game, we'll have to have a lot more time, we only got through 3 turns.
*NOTE: Randy/Adam, If I've missed any interesting parts of the game or if I've mistold something, feel free to post about it and correct me, I do have a bad memory after all.

Also, critical comment for discussion if I may: Some of the Apocalypse Assets actually made the game less fun than I thought it could have been. Specifically, Flank march and Disruptor Beacon. Without the Disruptor Beacon, the flank marching tyranids would have been able to eat the guards with very little resistance, but with it they were sent so far away they couldn't participate in the rest of the game. These two assets (Among others) seem to make Apocalypse a giant rock-paper-scissors match. Spore Chimneys likewise cause me personally a headache as I was playing a long range guard army that did as much damage in melee (killing two lichtors) as with my ranged firepower (Which killed a few gaunts with ordnance barrages and, thanks to a massive 15" 'master of ordnance shooting into night fighting' scatter roll, killed a few members of my ally's command squad.) Had it not been for the deepstriking terminators providing my army something to shoot at, they would've kept innefectually bombarding the tyranids.

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Guest on Sun Sep 27, 2009 5:03 pm

Apocalypse is supposed to be about fun, not picking the best things to win all the time.

A lot of groups I have heard about on the internet have banned the use of those two assets (Flank March and Disruptor Beacon) specifically for the points you raise.

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Paz on Sun Sep 27, 2009 5:40 pm

I think before any apocalypse game can be played, you really need to talk with the other players about stratagems. i once played a huge apoc. game against Nids, and my buddy took that smoke/spore mine wall thing'r, so for his first turn, I couldnt even shoot at his massive horde, which resulted in mass slaughter. On the flip side, another game against Nids, Me and a buddy took lots of chapter masters and the barrage stratagem. lets just say 11 large blasts and and apocalypse barrage wipes out Nids fast, and wasn't really fun for anyone.

Apocalypse lets you do whatever you want, little to no restrictions. This means, if someone wants to be a Debbie-downer and ruin it for everyone, they can. A small chat before hand can solve all problems.

P.S. At the same time, flank marching massive swarm Nids on a IG position? Not exactly "fair" either.

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Guest on Sun Sep 27, 2009 7:42 pm

actually what he was flank marching was all his monstrous/gargantuan creatures

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Paz on Sun Sep 27, 2009 11:23 pm

Actually, not any better though right?

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Guest on Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:15 am

No, not really(Was just clarifying), but ya can't blame him - facing a buncha firepower with a buncha 'targets' makes it hard to NOT want to flank march them rather than running them across the 2+ feet of killing grounds. I definitely understand WHY an army would take flank march - in a lot of cases it just makes sense.

I like the idea of going over things before to make the game more fun, but I find it difficult to bring up the subject of 'hey could you not use this' in a way that doesn't sound like I'm just trying to gain an advantage for myself (Or am I just being paranoid?).

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  System Commander on Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:04 am

Ive played about 12 big games of Apocalypse now, and I havent really encuontered any of these problems.

Disruptor beacon has to be deployed at the beginning of the game, so you know exactly where it is. As long as your outside of 48" from whichever edge, you dont have to worry about it. Even so, if your willing to take the 4+ risk, you know whats going to happen. Units can run now though, and can make up that ground pretty good (if you have the time that is). If you think something like that might happen though, you can always put one of your objectives deep back into your own deployment zone where you anticipate your opponent might place the disrupted units, then at the very least they can do something. However, if you only got three turns in.. yeah, there is nothing you could of done. Ive had some Apoc games go 4 turns, some go 12.. you just have to really make sure you alot the correct amount of time... at 8000 point a side you need pretty much a good 8 hours.

The first few games I played, I took Flank March alot... now I never take it. Its just not worth the risk of the Disruptor beason. Now, I tend to take some items such as Vital Objective, Careful Planning, Disrupt and Despoil.. some of the trickier assests. Disruptor beacon though is also on my short list.. especially if I know Im going up against an army with lots of deep strikers or something that might Flank March. If they dont take any of that, Im out an asset. Ive never had any of those strategems break the game though. Ive never gone against the Nid spore cloud.. so not sure about that one.

Most of the games Ive played have been real nailbiters.. but I have had some barn burners.. most notable the one against Joe about a month ago.. where his Revenent Titan pretty took out my whole army. The game was still a blast though.. and to my credit I should of killed it many times but couldnt seem to get past it's holo fields.

The Apocalypose games begin with the armies pretty close to each other.. potentially 12" apart. If you think your opponent is going to deploy deep deep into his own zone.. you can take things like Strategic Redeployment, which is good for nids.. there are definmitely lots of tactical options. Nids suffer alot in Apc games with their current codex. Yeah, you can get some decent cover saves.. but they've got pretty much nothing to help them at range. Apoc tends to have alot of vehicles on the table, and with only glancings, your lucky to get a couple vehicle kills an entire game. They are better if you can get a Flank March off, or bring a big beastie to help out,

My suggestion is to try more games, less points values..(once you get into those high points, the game gets really weird), and make sure you give your self alot of time.

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  Paz on Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:12 pm

Jemal wrote:No, not really(Was just clarifying), but ya can't blame him - facing a buncha firepower with a buncha 'targets' makes it hard to NOT want to flank march them rather than running them across the 2+ feet of killing grounds. I definitely understand WHY an army would take flank march - in a lot of cases it just makes sense.

Yeah I can see what you mean, with a lack of firepower, Nids can have a lot of trouble going up the field. i guess what I ment was that, if flank march is a huge part of your strategy, then getting smacked with a disruptor can end the game for ya, and make it less fun. As it takes a lot to play apocalypse games, and we often play so few, I guess its a learning experience. Smile

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  smackman on Tue Sep 29, 2009 2:00 am

Having only played 4 proper apoc games I have to say I agree with robyn, I don't think any of the strategems are broken and have never had one break a game for me to the point of not having fun, all they do is change my perception of how the game plays out and force me to adjust. However given that I've only played Apoc with Orks, Tau and Chaos, and only played against Demons, Chaos, Nids, Space Marines + Grey Knights and Space marines solo, it certainly makes a difference what you're up against but all of them have been enjoyable. I aslo closely stick to 5-6000pts if that makes a difference, I find that apocalypse has severe balancing and speed of play issues beyond 7000pts and under 4000pts, not that there aren't ways to unbalance it inside that range (12 demon princes less than 1500pts? Crazy?) but I find that size of game seems to promote a more fair army list.

This is just my experience with apocalypse and some suggestions, personally I'm a big fan of apocalypse and am happy with the current rules.

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  System Commander on Tue Sep 29, 2009 9:53 am

I forgot to mention this before, but you also really need to determine which rules your using for scoring purposes before the game begins.

The basic Apocalypse rules uses 4th edition scoring units.. so any vehicle that is not immobilized, and any unit at half strengh or above counts as a scoring unit. The basic book also has alot of strategems that play os this, like Hold at all costs, which allows any units below half to count as full. According to the Apoc rules, if there are multiple units within 6" of an objective, the side who has the most points within that area controls it.

This is vastly different from the current rules that only allows troops to control objectives. If you use the current 5th edition ruls, alot of strategems dont work, but it makes it a vastly different game.

I would reccomend deciding ahead of time which rules you want to use. I prefer sticking to the 5th edition rules myself.. but this means you need to bring a healthy dose of troops to the table... if you want to make sure you can take the majority of the 6 objectives.

I really wish GW would of addressed this. They have a small blurb in the Reload book about this.. but basically just say what I did.. you have to decide ahead of time.

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Re: Chaos bugs Attack!

Post  smackman on Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:48 pm

All the games I've played we've agreed ahead of time to use 5th rules for scoring units, and modified some stratagems to match, like hold at all costs allows any infantry unit (not just troops choices) to hold points.

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