Phil Kelly can lick my balls.

I hate to say I told you so, but....

My Chaos Codex Review:

Toughness 5 Obliterators: Good.
Chaos Marine Bikers: Playable.
Everything Else: Um....
Special WTF Entries: Chosen, Possessed, Warp Talons, Chaos Spawn, Daemon Princes, Defiler, Cultists, Mutilators

The man who brought us the 8 point Eldar Guardian has done it again.

I do really like the chosen.. You can make a pretty scary squad that can shoot with 4 plasma guns and assault better than berserkers. But.. Gets pricey quick and you need to field abbadon to make em troops.

Yeah.. Really ho hum. Nothing spectacular. Everything average. You know if all codexes were costed like the cjaos itd be one thing.. But with the last couple things seem so cheap.. no fantastic bargains in the book.

Oh.. I did notice predators were down. Plain predator with hvy bolter sponsons is 95 and a full lascannon compliment is 140.. So thats a decent deal.

I would of really liked a cheap cheap prince with a wimpier stat line and maybe the ootion to buy higher. I like ws 9 but i dont think i need it.. Or init 8. Hes in trouble of being shot down more than anything and those dont help out at all with that. Cheap ad possible with wings primarily for distraction. Im going to be hard pressed to takr a khorne one ever.. Why do i need furious charge for 15 points?

Oh.. Look at that.. Oblits are 5 points cheaper.. But dont have an invul save anymore..

I guess they can stay in cover the whole game.. But losing power fists, invul save and niy being able to fire the same weapon two rounds in a row is bizarre. Oh.. You can take a mark for each one.. And pay extra for it.

Now im getting irritated after sleeping on it..

Ive been trying to work up a decent berserker based list and its tough. A khorne only army is a bit ugly.. Considering the shooting nature of 6th.

Besides the new lord im not sure if theres anything im eeally excited about. Also just realized daemon princes lost eternal warrior.. Which means if you do take one.. You havento live in fear of rail guns and vindicators.. Again. *sigh*

Regards to Oblits and Daemon Princes, you need to dig into the rules a bit extra. They have the "daemon" status, which grants 5++ and fear

oblits have the daemon rule, so they still have 5+ invuln... and the ability to have grey knights pwn them even harder.

I've converted to a searchable pdf if you want that Robyn.

Oh yeah.. Sorry.. I did know that initially then it slipped my mind.

Still daemon princes with no eternal warrior gives me the shakes. I used to lose daemon princes to rail guns so often.. It would drive me bonkers.

yeah but now you can swoop over 24", next turn land jump forward 12" and assault 2d6 and kill all their rail guns.... but i still see your point especially since a swooping flying creature is especially vulnerable to massed small arms fire. I think i need to get the codex, is it in/out yet? :s And though i have yet to read the book i wouldnt count it out yet. One thing Phil's books tend to do is stand the test of time (even 2 editions later, see Eldar) so i wouldnt fret too much just yet.

Edit: Also note this is the first official 6th codex, so maybe its a taste of whats to come? (and from what i hear, its sounds quite well rounded nothing too spammable, like some other codexes....*looking at you grey knights* darn i need to pick it up...) So maybe 6th will be the slashing of the matt ward codexes? (would make me happy anyways)

Well.. At least the book looks really nice.. And the special characters at least look pretty useful.. Although lucius still seems a bit off.

I was thinkng more about maulerfiends. Man.. How annoying would it be to get immobilized halfway across the fueld. It will die only regens hull points.. Doh.

Forgefiends also have fleet.. Odd.

Id have no problem with that. Its just a bit deja vu'ish. The last chaos codex was amongst the first of the new codexes.. And it stopped with chaos after how mad people got.

It does seem well rounded and balanced overall.. Its just to bad we have a couple of the goofy books messing.things.up.

Who knows.. With the way faqs have been rolling out and some new white dwarf stuff.. things.could change quick.

I think chaos will be good combined with allies truthfully. I just have to.decide if.i want to go the guard or daemon route. Looking at the khorne prince.. Its such a small bump to take a naked bloodthister.

System Commander wrote:Oh.. Look at that.. Oblits are 5 points cheaper.. But dont have an invul save anymore..

I guess they can stay in cover the whole game.. But losing power fists, invul save and niy being able to fire the same weapon two rounds in a row is bizarre. Oh.. You can take a mark for each one.. And pay extra for it.

Now im getting irritated after sleeping on it..

Ive been trying to work up a decent berserker based list and its tough. A khorne only army is a bit ugly.. Considering the shooting nature of 6th.

Besides the new lord im not sure if theres anything im eeally excited about. Also just realized daemon princes lost eternal warrior.. Which means if you do take one.. You havento live in fear of rail guns and vindicators.. Again. *sigh*

Oblits come with power fists but they lose their fearless


chaos predators are cheaper than the old book, but still more expensive than space marine ones....

Aren't they fearless being daemons?
All the characters seem much better now, chaos lords/sorcerers are dirt cheap, with the new rules I think the defiler needs a higher point cost. 4 attacks base, 4 hullpoints and a 5+ invul with the battlecannon is scary. Plus daemon forge when he gets a good battlecannon shot can do tons of damage.
I'm more confused by some options that are redundant and some that make no sense.
Berserkers have furious charge but need to buy an icon that gives them furious change and the reroll charge range...?
And possessed can buy icon of flame so their bolt weapons that don't exist get soul blaze...?
Terminator options horribly expensive for characters too. Raptors look better and I want to like warp claws but finding it hard... Looking like I don't need to buy much at least my old list will work almost the same. Might pick up Fabius and make a 20man squad with all the fixings. Debating which mark between nurgle n tzeench..

You can tell this codex is one of those done at 3 in the morning....too many goofy entries which dont make sense:

Chaos lords can take veterans of the long war for 5 points, this only lets them hit space marine special characters on 3s considering they are already ws6 ld10

veterans of the long war's cost is not consistant through the book.

All the special characters are more or less expensive than before fairly randomly.

chainaxes are 3 points for nothing yet plague knives which do something are free

possessed didnt even get a thought...this is 3 books now they havent been fixed

cultists seem to have got rebalanced at the last minute to unplayable status. 4 points needing 1 point for a rapid fire gun making them worse than guardsmen

making drednaughts more expensive with the new rules makes no sense...they are 10 more points and lose an attack

mutilators....see entry chaos terminators for a better selection

thousand suns are still way over costed

the fixed the cost of alot of the fast attack choices, then imiediately invalidated them by making pikes 20 points each

raptors, the first hit and run unit still dont have this rule back

flakk missles: the ultimate bad player detector....25 points each for those, or maybe take a vendetta instead


chaos has no viable air defence

Its a good thing you guys are here to keep me on track. I didnt see that hiding in wargear.

Im also starting to like the idea of a tzeentch lord or sorc. With a 3+ invul.

judchic wrote:Aren't they fearless being daemons?
All the characters seem much better now, chaos lords/sorcerers are dirt cheap, with the new rules I think the defiler needs a higher point cost. 4 attacks base, 4 hullpoints and a 5+ invul with the battlecannon is scary. Plus daemon forge when he gets a good battlecannon shot can do tons of damage.
I'm more confused by some options that are redundant and some that make no sense.
Berserkers have furious charge but need to buy an icon that gives them furious change and the reroll charge range...?
And possessed can buy icon of flame so their bolt weapons that don't exist get soul blaze...?
Terminator options horribly expensive for characters too. Raptors look better and I want to like warp claws but finding it hard... Looking like I don't need to buy much at least my old list will work almost the same. Might pick up Fabius and make a 20man squad with all the fixings. Debating which mark between nurgle n tzeench..

daemon is only fear and 5+

sorcerers arent dirt cheap
berserkers have counter attack and rage...its wierd they dont have furious charge and need the banner for that

yeah characters are paying the old cost for terminator when it used to grant +1A...they should be paying the 25 point cost

Berserkers still have furious charge.. They can buy the banner that gives them furious charge and reroll charge.. At a cheaper cost because they have furious charge already.

I dont mind the new berserkers.. I dont like not being able to take a fist though. I guess i can but reading throuhh it really feels like i should prob gear them towards possible challenges. Ill have to try it out and see.

Vetran of the long war is hatred which I think is reroll to hit on the first round of close combat...
If its hit on 3's why would Kharn have it?

Yup.. Hatred is reroll misses.

Its much harder for kharne to kill his buddies hitting on 2's and rerolling misses.

Robyn, the Chosen are cut and pasted from the old book but they lost infiltrate. Now they are just chaos marines that pay 5 points more per model to not score and can pay even more for extra assault weapons. Garbage. So I guess they don't want to sell any of the Forge/Maulerfiend models. Thank goodness there's 8 heavy support choices! Let's take everything from a mediocre book and make it more expensive. Then add some overcosted new crap. You guys like cult marines as troops? Sorry, now you have to pay a lord surcharge. You want to infiltrate something? You can buy a special character that allows you to! He's only 160 points! Don't even get me started on Flakk missiles.

@Mike B. You wanted fearless cultists? Dream on my friend! And hey, you can pay an extra point for your autoguns too!

Deadlytoaster wrote: One thing Phil's books tend to do is stand the test of time (even 2 editions later, see Eldar) so i wouldnt fret too much just yet.

Is this a joke? Are you being serious?

They got an extra attack, marks got cheaper for them and attaching any fearless character makes cultists fearless.

judchic wrote:They got an extra attack, marks got cheaper for them and attaching any fearless character makes cultists fearless.

Um, they only have one attack on their profile. Are you referring to their pistol/close combat weapon? Would you honestly invest in any of the marks for a cultist unit? What fearless character would best be attached to a cultist unit?

Timbo wrote:

Deadlytoaster wrote: One thing Phil's books tend to do is stand the test of time (even 2 editions later, see Eldar) so i wouldnt fret too much just yet.

Is this a joke? Are you being serious?

No it is not a joke and yes i was being serious. I still win alot of games with my Eldar, even in 6th. Its alot more challenging granted but not un do-able. All i was getting at is that maybe you should give the new book a chance and actually play some games with it before you fly off the handle and say its total garbage. Think of it as a chance to sharpen up your play rather than being put off because things arnt what you expected them to be.

Timbo wrote:Robyn, the Chosen are cut and pasted from the old book but they lost infiltrate. Now they are just chaos marines that pay 5 points more per model to not score and can pay even more for extra assault weapons. Garbage. So I guess they don't want to sell any of the Forge/Maulerfiend models. Thank goodness there's 8 heavy support choices! Let's take everything from a mediocre book and make it more expensive. Then add some overcosted new crap. You guys like cult marines as troops? Sorry, now you have to pay a lord surcharge. You want to infiltrate something? You can buy a special character that allows you to! He's only 160 points! Don't even get me started on Flakk missiles.

@Mike B. You wanted fearless cultists? Dream on my friend! And hey, you can pay an extra point for your autoguns too!

Chosen have 2 attacks on profile which we missed going over the book last night. 5 points for 2 A 1 more leadership and bolpistol/sword/bolter aint soooo bad

I'm going to field Fabio and Typhus. and swarm all 'yall with Zombies and Roid monkies.