750 Recon Chaos

x10 chaos space marines
- aspiring champion with power fist
- x2 plasma guns
- icon of chaos glory
-230pts

x10 chaos space marines
- aspiring champion with power fist
- x2 meltaguns
- icon of chaos glory
- 220pts

x10 lesser daemons
- 130pts

x7 chaos space marines
- 1 plasma gun
- 120pts

Total: 750pts

So the idea here is to have the seven man squad sit on an objective near home then march towards the enemy with the twenty other space marines and deep strike the ten daemons as support.

There are two alternate plans to this list that I can't decide which is best. The second alternative involves thinning out the 7 man csm squad to a 5 man squad with no upgrades. Then subtracting two lesser daemons to a total of 8. Then adding two rhinos for both of the ten man csm squads. This alternative offers less home objective security, faster transportation with armour, and the ability to contest with rhinos if they are not destroyed.

The second list alternative puts more emphasis on home objective security. It involves upgrading the seven man squad to a ten man squad, and replacing the plasma gun with a lascannon. Then taking out the lesser daemons completely and outfitting the attacking csm squads with dedicated transports (rhinos). This alternative offers more home objective security, faster transportation with armour, but a costly ten troops less because of the lesser daemons. I don't like this list, I think it's plain and boring. Lesser daemons are really what makes recon games exciting for me. I just love the way they look when they jump in on an unsuspecting squad D:

Now I'm leaning more and more towards the side of less home security and more assaulty strength. The reason is because in pretty much every game I've played, I've never had the opponent come and try to take my home base. Usually my lists are so strong in the assault, we will duke it out in the center most of the game.

So let me know what you think. I guess the major questions here are, how important do you think armoured transportation is in a recon game? And, how important is home objective security? Which list do you like the best and why? Do you have any other suggestions or do you see anything that I have overlooked?

Thanks for reading I know it was kind of lengthy.

Ok well if nobody has anything to say about that list, how about this one for 1750 points.

HQ
Ezekiel Abaddon the Despoiler! 275pts

Elites
x5 Terminators 205
- x3 combi meltas
- reaper autocannon
- chain fist
- icon of chaos glory

Troops
x10 Chaos Space Marines 230pts
- Aspiring Champion with power fist
- x2 plasma guns
- icon of chaos glory
- Rhino dedicated transport 35pts

x10 Chaos Space Marines 220pts
- Aspiring Champion with power fist
- x2 meltaguns
- icon of chaos glory
- Rhino dedicated transport 35pts

x10 Chaos Space Marines 225pts
- Aspiring Champion with power weapon
- lascannon and plasma gun
- icon of chaos glory
- Rhino dedicated transport 35pts

x10 Lesser Daemons 130pts

Heavy Support
x2 Defilers 300pts
- both with x2 dreadnought close combat weapons

Total: 1750

So what do you think?

Well gee stealth992 I don't really know what the best recon list would be. But I guess there is only one way to find out, test them out and see what's best. And maybe you'll find out some work best against certain armies or players.

And in regards to your 1750 pt list, I think you need more obliterators and more daemon princes and less defilers and less Abaddon. Maybe one less defiler and two more obliterators. The reason I say this is not because defilers are bad, but because obliterators are so good. Obliterators are a more reliable anti tank unit whereas the defiler will scatter 2/3 of the time. Also, defilers are big and tough to hide, and with only 12 armour they can easily get blown up. If you take out Abaddon and two terminators, you can put in two demon princes with wings and warptime. Abaddon is just a close combat over kill that will get shot to death when he deep strikes.

stealth992 wrote:Well gee stealth992 I don't really know what the best recon list would be. But I guess there is only one way to find out, test them out and see what's best. And maybe you'll find out some work best against certain armies or players.

And in regards to your 1750 pt list, I think you need more obliterators and more daemon princes and less defilers and less Abaddon. Maybe one less defiler and two more obliterators. The reason I say this is not because defilers are bad, but because obliterators are so good. Obliterators are a more reliable anti tank unit whereas the defiler will scatter 2/3 of the time. Also, defilers are big and tough to hide, and with only 12 armour they can easily get blown up. If you take out Abaddon and two terminators, you can put in two demon princes with wings and warptime. Abaddon is just a close combat over kill that will get shot to death when he deep strikes.

Well gee stealth992 thanks for your input. I definitely think you're right about the recon list.

In regards to your comments about my 1750 list, you may very well be right. But I have a few problems. 1. I don't have any demons princes or obliterators. 2. I really like the story line of Abaddon the Despoiler and the defilers go well with the theme because Abaddon fashioned defilers himself. 3. I like to be original. If I had known chaos was so popular when I started, I might have picked a different army. I can't bring myself to play demon princes and obliterators because they are too generic and commonly regarded as the 'best choices'.

So I guess I'm just trading competitiveness for theme. As I think Warhammer should be about fun. I'd rather lose with an army that I like, than win with a cookie cutter army.

alright so I tested out the 750 pt recon list. This is the list I used against it...

Elites
x5 Raptors 165pts
- Aspiring Champion with lightning claws
- flamer
- icon of Slaanesh

Troops 250pts
x10 Khorne Berzerkers
- Skull Champion with power fist
- rhino dedicated transport 35pts

x9 Khorne Berzerkers 189pts
- rhino dedicated transport 35pts

x5 Chaos Space Marines 75pts

Total: 749pts

And well, by turn two, ten chaos space marines were dead. Lesser daemons failed to be summoned. Then by turn three my last two remaining space marine squads got assaulted and the icons were killed so my daemons could not enter the game. My space marines were completely annihilated by the end of turn three and my 9 man squad of Khorne Berzerkers didn't even exit their rhino all game...

So basically, 10 Khorne Berzerkers, 5 Raptors, and a Rhino killed 27 chaos space marines, barely breaking a sweat. The chaos space marines weren't shooty enough to kill the Khorne Berzerkers before they got into assault. And then the chaos space marines weren't killy enough to win in assault.

Chaos space marines are good because you get more troop numbers and they are versatile. But when faced with a dedicated shooty or assaulty opponent, they are outmatched.

I wanted to either do a chaos undivided list, or a hardcore Khorne list. But after seeing what Khorne just did to my space marines... I think I'm gonna have to make the most bloodiest, assaultiest, messiest Khorne list I possibly can. So this is it.

HQ
Abaddon the Despoiler 275pts
Kharn the Betrayer 165pts

Elites
x3 Terminators 105pts
- x3 combi meltas

Troops
x8 Khorne Berzerkers 208pts
- Skull champion with power fist and personal icon
- Rhino 35pts

x7 Khorne Berzerkers 147pts
- in Rhino with Kharn 35pts

x10 Chaos Space Marines 240pts
- Aspiring Champion with power fist
- x2 meltaguns
- Icon of Khorne
- Rhino 35pts

x8 Lesser Daemons 104pts
- Bloodletter models XD

x5 Chaos Space Marines 100pts
- plasma gun
- Icon of Chaos Glory

Heavy Support
x2 Defilers 300pts
- all close combat weapons

Total: 1749pts

This extreme list is seriously lacking two things. 1. Long range anti tank. 2. Strong defense for home objective.

But I guess as they say, the best defense is a better offense.