The Battle for Dan's Basement

Dan and I had an epic battle last evening. I'll try and summarize the epic battle. As a bit of a lead-in, I've noticed something about the Chaos list with Daemon Allies, it seems to start strong, then wane in the late stages of the game. (Glass Cannons + Low model count?)
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My list|
Ahriman, 210 point Tzeentch Sorcerer with all the bells and whistles (Including teh scrolls of magnus).
15 thousand sons, double-plasma CSM in a rhino, Mark of Tzeentch (6++ baby!)
3xOblits and a Forgefiend
Herald of Tzeentch, Pink Horrors, and my Burning Chariot

Dan's list (from my memory of not reading his list that close) (wolves with guard allies)
HQ Dude in Power Armour with a Storm Shield and Thunderhammer
2xdudes in Razorbacks, 2xdudes in rhinos (grey hunters?)
Those cool missile things with skyfire from IA
Allies, Special HQ Russ (punisher), Elite Russ thingy(plasma), Troops Russ(plasma), and a Hydra.

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Psychic Shenanigans:
Ahriman: Doombolt, Breath of Chaos, Haemorrage, Lifeleech
Krenxor: Doombolt, Breath of Chaos, Lifeleech
Asp Sorc: Boon of Mutation

Dan's Warlord Trait: Legendary Fighter
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Mission: Purge the Alien (Yay!), Hammer and Anvil (Boo!) -- Advantages stay pretty even.
It be dark out.

Dan deploys first and has everything mounted up. Fairly even spread across his deployment zone, about 12-18" on to the table, deploying to take advantage of his superior range.

I deploy next. There's some very thick ruins, so I infiltrated my 15 thousand sons up on the side of the table, fairly bunched up, but out of sight, about 14" away from the Hydra on the right flank. My Burning Chariot infiltrated behind a ruin as well, but a ways away from the action. Forgefiend and Rhino deployed on the same right flank as the T-Sons. Horrors arriving by Deepstrike, Oblits deepstriking as well.

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Turn One: Dan

Dan attempts to move, one russ on the right flank immobalizes in difficult terrain, as does the hydra tank. His punisher advances up the left flank. Razorbacks move to the right flank to help the oncoming tide.

Dan can't see too much. I deployed my Forgefiend about 38" away from his missile battery. One of his russes now has a shot at the bunched up thousand sons, he can see 3. After all the plasma dust settles, three is what he kills (that's exactly how many saves I failed out of 8!)

Dan manages a potshot at my Chariot, but it saves, and a shot at my forgefiend, which fails to penetrate.

Turn One: Me

I pop my Scrolls, gaining Enfeeble, but taking a wound in the process. This'll come in handy, but currently there are no worthwhile ground-based targets. My Sorcerer attempts to boon Ahriman. Fails to wound, but rolls snake-eyes on the boon table (no effect). Ah well. Rhino moves up 12" (and turbo boosts 6" up the right flank. Burning chariot goes up the left flank (and turbo-boosts)

The Thousand sons walk up the right flank. Ahriman fires a Doombolt off on a razorback, popping it and earning First Blood, out of the six guys inside, I deal 3 wounds, Dan Failed 2 saves.

Forgefiend takes a couple pot-shots at the Hydra, it saves due to the darkness.

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Turn 2: Dan

Dan manovers his tanks to get into better firing position on the right flank. The punisher moves up to the left to deal with the burning chariot.

Dan's command razorback moves up a bit, backfield shifts positions.

Unloading on the Thousand Sons earns Dan a few dead marines, (about 4 this time) from all the plasma shooting. Dan unloads on the chariot with the punisher, scoring 3 glancing hits and 2 penetrating hits. I save the glances, but the pens get through (4+, re-roll 1's). The pens blow up the chariot.

Dan takes a couple more pot-shots at the Forgefiend, he scores a glance from the missile batteries, but I make my Daemon save.

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Turn 2: Me

Krenxor's not feeling to brave with his scroll, he does enfeeble the unit on the ground though. Rhino moves up, dudes get out. Thousand Sons move around the ruin a bit to flank the Command razorback on both it's front and rear arc's. My oblits and horrors both come on this turn.

My Oblits deep strike 6" away from the immobalized russ. My Horrors deepstrike 20" away from the command razorback, then use the Grimoire of True Names to earn a 3++ save.

The horrors open up shooting. The herald gets 4D6 shots, the horrors 2D6 shots, they both unload on the Razorback. The Herald gets 16 shots, the horrors 3. With that, they get 2 glances and 3 pens, none of the pens blow up the tank though, the occupants unload as far as they can from the Thousand Sons.

The Oblits open up on a russ with twin-linked melta guns, getting 2 hits, one glance and one bounce. Ugh... these guys are in for a world of hurt.

Forgefiend pops daemon forge and shoots at the Hydra, blowing it to bits. The troops that walked out of the rhino finished off the guys on foot.

The thousand sons charge into the occupants from the wrecked razorback, losing one to overwatch fire. I issue a challenge with my plain jane sorcerer. Ahriman and Krenxor demolish the guys on foot to two men, which the thousand sons clean up (yay veterans of the long war). My Sorcerer scores 4 hits and two wounds against Dan's wolf-lord. Dan's a team player and fails both saves. Thanks buddy! Dan's Wolf-Lord then kills the champ. (Ouch!). Dan runs away, but I catch him, so the combat continues.

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Turn 3: Dan

Dan unloads a rhino of grey hunter dudes into some ruins by the oblits. They open fire with a couple of plasma guns and some bolters, killing 2 whole obilits! One of the russes finishes off the last one (not a single 6 rolled ) The other russ is then free to turn it's attention to the marines on foot. They're spaced out, but 5 plasma cannon shots makes short work of them! Missiles help finish off what didn't die. The punisher opens up on the pink horrors, scoring 18 wounds! Two pink horrors die (3++, re-roll 1's)

Combat time. Ahriman issues a challenge. Hits twice, wounds twice, Dan makes his save. Dan hits twice, wounds twice, Ahriman fails a save, fails a re-roll (due to extra dudes) and dies.

Turn 3: Mark

Krenxor casts Enfeeble on Dan's Warlord. The pink horrors use the book, but it fails them, dropping their save to 6++.

Forgefiend opens up on the russ, hoping to take it's last hullpoint, gets 5 hits, but no sixes. The horrors move up and space out. They shoot at the now empty rhino, destroying it.

Combat ensues! Krenxor scores 3 hits (3 attacks hitting on 4's, that's fair right?) 2 wounds, Dan makes both saves. Dan attacks back, 2 hits, 2 wounds, I make both 3++ saves (but needed a re-roll from the cheer-leaders)

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Turn 4: Dan

Dan moves his tanks around a bit. The punisher unloads on the pink horrors. 6++ makes them a lot less resilient, they all die. The missile launchers blow up my now empty Rhino.

Dan shoots his Russ at my Forgefiend. It get's hot and loses it's last hullpoint! Thanks buddy! The other russ unloads on the forge fiend, scoring a glance, the forgefiend saves.

Off to combat. Krenxor finally takes the last wound off the Warlord. He then rolls on the boon chart and.... re-roll armour saves! I hear that's okay.

Turn 4: Mark

Krenxor and co approach the ruins containing some grey hunters. The forgefiend advances towards the last full rhino.

Forgefiend pops the rhino, killing two marrines, I assault into the ruins, killing a bunch of hunters, and chasing them to stay incombat. On the way in, Krenzor used Lifeleech to re-gain his lost wound.

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Turn 5: Dan

Russes can't shoot at much. Tries to take down the forgefiend, but to no avail.

Combat carries on with the grey hunters, they're killed down to two dudes and run, I let them run.

Turn 5: Mark

Krenxor leaves the T-Sons unit and waltzes over to the grey hunters that are on the field. The Forgefiend shoots at them, killing none. The thousand sons get only a couple shots off at the running grey hunters, inflicting only 1 wound, which Dan makes his cover save.

Assaults, the forge fiend charges into the grey hunters, absorbing the overwatch fire. Krenxor makes the charge on the other side (Needing 6" through terrain). Krenxor hits 4 times, gets 4 wounds. The forge fiend kills one guy. Power fist on the Forgefiend, hits, pens, but the fiend makes his daemon save. Krenxor gets hit 4 times, wounded 3, takes a wound (even with re-rolling saves!)

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Turn 6: Dan.

The grey hunters move up, the tanks unload on the thousand sons, killing all but one.

Dan charges the last thousand son. He lives, but kills no one in return.

Krenxor kills 2 more grey hunters, they get 3 wounds back at him. Krenxor fails a save and dies! Darn! The Forgefiend does an additional wound, killing a guy. Then it's fist time! Fist does nothing

Turn 6: Mark

My Thousand son lives, my forgefiend lives

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Turn 7:

My forgefiend and thousand son both live, without killing anything (both turns)

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Results!

Me, 9 hefty killpoints, +1 First Blood, +1 Slay the Warlord, +1 Linebreaker! (woo-hoo, 15 thousand sons is better than 14)
Total: 12 Points

Dan, 9 killpoints, +1 Slay the Warlord, +2 Legendary Fighter Warlord Trait
Total: 12 Points.

A Tie!

You may be on to something.

From our game last week, besides the obvious (I think I rolled lucky and you rolled slightly unlucky thru out the game. Other than the one turn with my 3 Deny the witch in a row, I don't think it was a majorly big deal)

By having as many units as you did in reserve, I found my target selection was pretty easy. First turn make sure the Chariot and Forgefiend die, then I only had to deal with 3? units (1k Sons, horrors, and oblits).

After that I could kinda deal with them piece meal.

That looks like the same list, except you had Mutilators in my game.

Ahriman infiltrating with Mutilators or Oblits was a much better option than outflanking him with the Rhino, I think. I think we're disagreeing on whether he can do that tho.

My advice: Infiltrate rather than Outflank (so you are in their face turn one) and a Heldrake. I have no idea what to drop for that tho:)

I need more all daemon games under my belt before i get a good feel of what they can do.. But i do think a csm/daemon list has a bit more staying power then an all daemon list.

Instability is pretty nasty if you ever lose an assault. I have to be alot more careful in the future what i assault or.can be assaulted.by.

It does suck having to worry about insta kill again.. I really wish there was an option for collars.of khorne or somethng on heralds or princes... Those would be handy.

I was very pleased infiltrating him up with the T-Sons. There's always the potential that they can get Endurance. If the Scroll gets me Gate of Infinity, that unit becomes super fun. If the FAQ so the herald of Tzeentch can join Mark of Tzeentch units (unlikely, but Yakface is making the argument)... suddenly, redonkulous (AP3 with ignores cover)

Wedging a Heldrake into the list isn't that tough, actually, swap the marines for a unit of Cultists. The thought's crossed my mind, I think I could even handle painting one.

My two minor mistakes against Dan were how I moved up my Burning Chariot (and where!), and not hiding my Rhino after dropping off dudes. Also, I should've challenged with my 3++ save dude first.

Edit: I've never had to really care about instability, as I've been playing Pink Horrors.