escalation siege vanguard

here's my 3 lists that i'm going to try out

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1000 Pts - Siege Assault Vanguard Roster
HQ
Space Marine Siege Master, 135 pts
Frag & Krak Grenades
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Signum
Bolt Pistol
Bolter
Siege Master - May Re-roll reserves, and before deployment, a
single infantry, tank, or vehicle squadron may be given Tank Hunters or Furious
Charge.
Troop
5 Bolter Scouts, 85 pts
Heavy Bolter w/Hellfire Shells
Infiltrate
Move Through Cover
Scouts
5 Sniper Scouts, 100 pts
Camo Cloaks
Sniper Rifle x4
Missile Launcher
Infiltrate
Move Through Cover
Scouts

Tactical Squad, 285 pts
Meltagun
Multi-melta
Siege Mantlet (+50pts upgrade) - Unit may not ride in a rhino or razorback, may not run, and may not make sweeping advances. in exchange, unit may re-roll failed armor saves against shooting attacks only.
Veteran Sergeant Haas (+60pts upgrade)
Bolt Pistol
Power Sword
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Always Advance - Haas and his Tactical Squad have the Relentless USR

Siege Dreadnought Talon, 290 pts
Brethren of Ancients - if half of more of the total number of dreadnoughts in the army are destroyed, the remaining dreadnought(s) in the Talon gain the Rage USR.
Siege Dreadnought Talon - The dreadnoughts in this formation must be initially deployed within 6" of one another. afterwards, they are treated as independent units and are NOT treated as a squadron
Ironclad Dreadnought #1
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
2 Hunter-Killer Missiles
Move Through Cover
Ironclad Dreadnought #2
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
Chainfist with Melta Gun
Hurricane Bolter
Move Through Cover
Heavy
Thunderfire Cannon, 100 pts

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1500 Pts - Siege Assault Vanguard Roster





HQ
Space Marine Siege Master, 135 pts
Frag & Krak Grenades
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Signum
Bolt Pistol
Bolter
Siege Master - May Re-roll reserves, and before deployment, a
single infantry, tank, or vehicle squadron may be given Tank Hunters or Furious
Charge.
Troop
5 Bolter Scouts, 85 pts
Heavy Bolter w/Hellfire Shells
Infiltrate
Move Through Cover
Scouts

5 Sniper Scouts, 100 pts
Camo Cloaks
Sniper Rifle x4
Missile Launcher
Infiltrate
Move Through Cover
Scouts

Tactical Squad, 285 pts
Meltagun
Multi-melta
Siege Mantlet (+50pts upgrade) - Unit may not
ride in a rhino or razorback, may not run, and may not make sweeping
advances. in exchange, unit may re-roll failed armor saves against
shooting attacks only.
Veteran Sergeant Haas (+60pts upgrade)
Bolt Pistol
Power Sword
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Always Advance - Haas and his Tactical Squad have the Relentless USR

Siege Dreadnought Talon, 430 pts
Brethren of Ancients - if half of more of the total number
of dreadnoughts in the army are destroyed, the remaining dreadnought(s)
in the Talon gain the Rage USR.
Siege Dreadnought Talon - The dreadnoughts in this formation
must be initially deployed within 6" of one another. afterwards, they
are treated as independent units and are NOT treated as a squadron
Ironclad Dreadnought #1
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
2 Hunter-Killer Missiles
Move Through Cover
Ironclad Dreadnought #2
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
Chainfist with Melta Gun
Hurricane Bolter
Move Through Cover
Siege Dreadnought
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
2 Hunter-killer
Missiles
Assault Drill with Heavy Flamer
Multi-melta
Heavy
Thunderfire Cannon, 100 pts
Thunderfire Cannon, 100 pts
Predator Tank Squadron, 260 pts
Predator Destructor #1
Hunter-killer Missile
Autocannon
Lascannon Sponsons
Predator Destructor #2
Hunter-killer Missile
Autocannon
Lascannon Sponsons

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2000 Pts - Siege Assault Vanguard Roster















HQ
Space Marine Siege Master, 135 pts
Frag & Krak Grenades
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Signum
Bolt Pistol
Bolter
Siege Master - May Re-roll reserves, and before deployment, a
single infantry, tank, or vehicle squadron may be given Tank Hunters or Furious
Charge.
Lord High Commander Culln, 215 pts
Iron Halo
Teleport Homer
Orbital Bombardment
Master
Crafted Storm Bolter
Eternal Warrior
Blade of the Scorpion - Counts as a Master-crafted Str 6 Power Weapon. If Culln's WS is greater than the highest WS of the enemy or enemies he is fighting, he gains bonus attacks equal to the difference in their WS characteristics. (IE, WS 6 vs WS 3 = +3 attacks to his base 4 attacks that assault phase)
Chapter Tactics - Tactical Squad sergeants may be replaced
with an Apothecary for free. Apothecary cannot take wargear beyond that
which a command squad Apothecary is allowed to wield.
Proud to
Live, Proud to Die, Hard to Kill - While Culln is alive, he and all other Red Scorpion units within 12" add +1 to their total score for the purposes of determining CQC resolution. Note that this bonus does not stack.
Troop
7 Bolter Scouts, 111 pts
Heavy Bolter w/Hellfire Shells
Infiltrate
Move Through Cover
Scouts

5 Sniper Scouts, 100 pts
Camo Cloaks
Sniper Rifle x4
Missile Launcher
Infiltrate
Move Through Cover
Scouts

Tactical Squad, 285 pts
Meltagun
Multi-melta
Siege Mantlet (+50pts upgrade) - Unit may not
ride in a rhino or razorback, may not run, and may not make sweeping
advances. in exchange, unit may re-roll failed armor saves against
shooting attacks only.
Veteran Sergeant Haas (+60pts upgrade)
Bolt Pistol
Power Sword
Artificer Armour
Iron Halo
Always Advance - Haas and his Tactical Squad have the Relentless USR
Tactical Squad, 230 pts
Plasma Gun
Heavy Bolter
Siege Mantlet (+50pts upgrade) - Unit may not
ride in a rhino or razorback, may not run, and may not make sweeping
advances. in exchange, unit may re-roll failed armor saves against
shooting attacks only.
Apothecary Sergeant (Free upgrade)
Bolt Pistol
Chain Sword
Narthecium
Feel No Pain

Siege Dreadnought Talon, 430 pts
Brethren of Ancients - if half of more of the total number
of dreadnoughts in the army are destroyed, the remaining dreadnought(s)
in the Talon gain the Rage USR.
Siege Dreadnought Talon - The dreadnoughts in this formation
must be initially deployed within 6" of one another. afterwards, they
are treated as independent units and are NOT treated as a squadron
Ironclad Dreadnought #1
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
2 Hunter-Killer Missiles
Move Through Cover
Ironclad Dreadnought #2
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
Chainfist with Melta Gun
Hurricane Bolter
Move Through Cover
Siege Dreadnought
Extra Armor
Searchlight
Smoke Launchers
2 Hunter-killer
Missiles
Assault Drill with Heavy Flamer
Multi-melta
Heavy
Thunderfire Cannon, 100 pts
Thunderfire Cannon, 100 pts
Predator Tank
Squadron, 290 pts
Predator Destructor #1
Extra Amor
Hunter-killer Missile
Autocannon
Lascannon Sponsons
Predator Destructor #2
Extra Armor
Hunter-killer Missile
Autocannon
Lascannon Sponsons

I really dont think Seige vanguard become viable til 2000, and doesn't come into its own until 2500. But if it floats your boat....

2 things:

1) Other than adding Seige Manlets and the Seige Master, you can do everything with a standard list. Yeah, you'd have to drop a TF or a Pred, but th Talon moves to Elites, and *poof* Vanilla codex. Not a knock, just an observation.

2) Can you take Haas? I know you can take High Commander Culln (the Chapter Master) as the list says you can take any of the Badab special characters.... But Haas's entry says he's an upgrade to Tactical Squad in a Space Marine army. The Storm Eagle and the like make a clear distinction between a Space Marine Army and a Seige Vanguard (Storm Eagle can be taken by both, etc.).

you're right on the first point; apart from the mantlets and the siege master, there's nothing in this army people havent seen a vanilla army use before. almost like i planned that....ooo. blew my own mind just now. lol.

it fell to 2 reasons why i did that; 1, i dont have a rediculous collection of tanks and dreads to go that route with the army (yea i own 6 dreads in my chosen livery, but 3 of those are gun-toting and you cant use those in a talon). and 2, i dont have the spare bodies to 100% wysiwyg mantlets onto 3+ squads of marines.

people focus on the tank squads when they see this army setup, but i think the troop choices are where its at. you basically take a tactical squad and let him re-roll armor saves against shooting, so guys with troop-heavy collections benefit from this army too. and dont forget the troop-choice assault squads on foot; they get the usual flamer or plasma pistol, plus a melta gun choice, plus a power sword choice. so you'd be able to field walking tacticals that get 2 meltaguns and +1 base attacks, but they lose 24" range cause they've only got the pistol. that same squad can also pay 25pts and everyone gets a combat shield, and pay another 30pts and everyone gets a melta bomb. granted, you're forced to take a 10 man squad with a base cost of 175 for the siege assault squad.

in regards to Haas, i can't find anything that says he 'cant' be taken, so i tossed him in cause he's in the one squad i always field. and cause i like the model itself.

i'll be testing the 1500 list against mark this friday, we'll see how it plays.

That "re-rolls failed armour saves from shooting" is kinda good.

I'd have to agree with Beau on the Dreads, but we'll see, they could work out really well too. One thing about 40K that I've noticed over the years, the one thing a player has the most control over is deployment and movement. Being forced to deploy your dreadnaughts together may not sounds like that bad of a thing, but it's a bit of a disadvantage, especially in a dawn-of-war scenario and your opponent deny-deploys you.

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Mike, We'll play the 1500 point scenario Beau has, that's battlefield control -> Table Quarters -> Objectives -> Kill Points

sounds good mark.

looking at it some more, in case beau's right and Haas really cant be chosen, i redid the 3 lists:

1000 Pts - Siege Assault Vanguard Army

HQ

Siege Master, 135 pts (Artificer Armour; Iron Halo; Signum; Bolt Pistol; Bolter x1; Siege Master)

Troops

5 Sniper Scouts, 100 pts (Camo Cloaks; Bolt Pistol x5; Sniper Rifle x4; Missile Launcher; Infiltrate; Move Through Cover; Scouts)

10 Siege Assault Squad, 195 pts (Meltagun x2; The Tip of the Spear)

5 Combat Squad, 140 pts (Siege Mantlets)

Siege Dreadnought Talon, 430 pts (Brethren of Ancients; Siege Dreadnought Talon)
Ironclad Dreadnought (Hunter-Killer Missiles x2; Dreadnought CCW with Storm Bolter; Seismic Hammer with Meltagun; Move Through Cover)
Ironclad Dreadnought (Chainfist with Meltagun; Hurricane Bolter; Move Through Cover)
Siege Dreadnought (Hunter-killer Missiles x2; Assault Drill with Heavy Flamer; Multi Melta)

1500pts Adds:

1 model to 5 man combat squad (total of 6)

10 Tactical Squad, 230 pts (Siege Mantlet; Plasma gun; Missile Launcher)

Heavy

Predator Tank Squadron, 250 pts (treats stunned as shaken, immobilized as destroyed)
1 Predator (Hunter-killer Missile; Autocannon; Lascannon Sponsons)
1 Predator (Autocannon; Lascannon Sponsons)

2000pts Adds:

Lord High Commander Culln, 215 pts (Iron Halo; Teleport Homer; Blade of the Scorpion; Master Crafted Storm Bolter; Eternal Warrior; Orbital Bombardment; Proud to Live, Proud to Die, Hard to Kill)

Siege Assault Squad gains a Land Raider Dedicated Transport

2 Models to combat squad [total of 8]

both tactical sergeants become apothecaries

Mark: Keep in mind the mod I made to the Dawn of War deployment for this tourney, you MUST deploy 1HQ and 2 Troops. No Deploy/Deny.

Mike: I'll look over things w/ Haas, but for what it's worth, I think the second list is better. My feeling on Seige is Dread Talon and Assault Squads in LR are the money units in that Codex

Can I haz stupid question? What's a Siege Dreadnaught? It sounds awesome.

I'm a *HUGE* fan of Ironclad dreads. I love that loadout.

siege dreads are an olllld unit from... 4th? i think, that was redesigned. it originally comes with a flamestorm cannon and a siege drill with inbuilt heavy flamer, and back then it used the hellhound's flamer rule for the flamestorm.

now its the same flamestorm cannon off a land raider redeemer.

so they added the option you can trade the flamestorm for a multi-melta for free, and can add up to 2 hunter-killer missiles on it. those are its only wargear options.

in a siege talon the dreads only have to deploy together after that they act on there own independently